Day 007 - 06 Jul 94 - Page 15

     
     1        A.  Yes.
 
     2   Q.   It includes Wednesday.  But it does not mean "through
              Wednesday" and carrying on.  If I went "through Wednesday"
     3        in English, I would still be going.  That is not what it
              means to an American, is it?
     4        A.  Right.
 
     5   MR. RAMPTON:  Do you know the date at which polystyrene foam
              was discarded by McDonald's for most of its packaging in
     6        favour of paper?
              A.  Yes, that was in 1990, at the beginning of the year.
     7
         Q.   So "through the 80s" in American is correct?  We go
     8        through the 80's and stop at the 90's?
              A.  Yes.
     9
         Q.   Going back in time, during the 1970s, what were the
    10        blowing agents most commonly used in the United States for
              McDonald's polystyrene foam?
         A.  Again predominantly hydrocarbons, but some of our
              suppliers also did use CFCs, chloro-fluoro carbons.
    12
         Q.   Going on, to use the English form, through the 1980's?
    13        A.  Through the 1980's we began a transition away from
              chloro-fluoro carbons as environmental science showed a
    14        potential for the chloro-fluoro carbons to deplete our
              upper ozone layer.
    15
         Q.   I want to go into that in a little more detail.  Do you
    16        remember something called the Montreal Convention Treaty
              or Protocol in September 1987?
    17        A.  I do.
 
    18   Q.   I think the date of its actual signature was 16th
              September 1987?
    19        A.  OK, yes.
 
    20   Q.   At that time, I should add this:  It is right, is it not,
              that the effect of that Convention was to limit or try to
         reduce the use of CFCs?
              A.  To reduce fully halogenative CFCs, yes.
    22
         Q.   Were you conscious at that time whether or not CFCs had
    23        already come under suspicion as being hazardous to the
              ozone layer?
    24        A.  Yes, at that point in time there was already suspicion
              and Mr. Langert can testify further, but I do believe that
    25        in 1987, in August, McDonald's had already committed to
              phasing out of the use of CFCs in a foam for McDonald's 
    26        domestic US consumption. 
  
    27   Q.   Mr. Kouchoukos, is it part of your task, your job, to keep
              abreast of what I might call perceived scientific wisdom
    28        of matters of this kind?
              A.  Yes, it is.
    29
         Q.   The change from CFCs took place, therefore, from about
    30        that date onwards, did it?
              A.  It did.  It took about 18 months for us to develop a