SENATOR SMITH: On that point, have you cabled your London office any directions regarding the crew?
MR. FRANKLIN: You asked me on Saturday night to get for you the name and address of every man going home on the Lapland?
SENATOR SMITH: Yes.
MR. FRANKLIN: I told the manager of our steamship department yesterday morning there to assure himself that he had that and would send it down, or to cable over so that it would be gotten before the ship gets there. Is that what you are driving at, Senator?
SENATOR SMITH: That is what I want in the record. I would also like the statement in the record of your offer to furnish for this committee any surviving officer, any officer or member of the crew whom we may desire to examine.
MR. FRANKLIN: We assure you that we will give you all the information you desire, and we will see that anybody under our control that you desire to appear before you does so appear.
SENATOR SMITH: That is my understanding.
MR. FRANKLIN: If that is not as strong as you want it­­
SENATOR BOURNE: That is a voluntary offer on the part of the company?
MR. FRANKLIN: We made the offer to Senator Smith the moment we saw him at the gang plank of the Carpathia. To the best of my knowledge and belief, I told you that we would cooperate with you in every way, and be very glad to have anybody you wanted appear before you.
SENATOR SMITH: Then there has been no attempt by your company or any officer or subordinate of your company to spirit away any member of the crew or any surviving officer of the Titanic?
MR. FRANKLIN: To the best of my knowledge and belief, no.
SENATOR SMITH: I think you had better put into the record your motive in wanting to get these men out of the country.
MR. FRANKLIN: Men arriving under these extraordinary circumstances, not being on articles, are very difficult, at times, to control, because a great many people are running after them for stories, and making them presents, and taking them out in the street. They stray away, and they get into endless trouble; and they are not controllable as are seamen and firemen ordinarily from a ship when it is in the dock under the command of an officer, and everything of that sort.
It is the duty of every owner or representative of an owner of a steamship, under similar circumstances, to get those men out of these temptations, and to get them away to their own homes and their own people, and where they can go back again and sign on another ship, and go to sea.
SENATOR SMITH: Is that the sole motive that you had in wanting to get them out of the country?
MR. FRANKLIN: That is the only motive I had. I never thought anything about anything else.
SENATOR BOURNE: In a case like that, if you have a sister ship, or a ship of the same company, it is used as the home of your employees, and the method of transporting them to their homes?
MR. FRANKLIN: Yes. As quickly as we can get them back.
SENATOR BOURNE: That is quite the custom?
MR. FRANKLIN: Yes. If we have a steamer coming in from the Mediterranean, and we do not need the crew, we send them on somebody else's line, or get them to Boston; we get them away. We do not want to have them a minute longer than we have to.
SENATOR SMITH: So far as you know are these men who are survivors of the Titanic to be reemployed by your company?
MR. FRANKLIN: They will certainly be reemployed if they appear for service?
SENATOR SMITH: Are they still in your service?
MR. FRANKLIN: No, sir; technically speaking, they are not, for the reason that the moment a ship goes down, the men's wages cease. But we, of course, take care of them.
There is one other thing I would like to say, and that is this: I think you gentlemen will realize that, under the conditions of this fearful disaster, no man in the crew could tell any story that could do us harm. Here were all the passengers and everybody else, who were there, and what difference would it make to us what the crew said? The worst thing they could say could not remedy the matter; could not help the matter, in any way, shape or form.
SENATOR SMITH: You consider that anything they might say would be simply cumulative?
MR. FRANKLIN: Yes; as far as I am personally concerned, I can say that I did not care a bit what the members of the crew said.
SENATOR FLETCHER: You said that as soon as the ship went down, the wages of the men ceased, but that you took care of them. Is there not an English law that gives them a remedy, and provides for the payment of so much a week under such circumstances?
MR. FRANKLIN: I am not clear on that, without looking it up. We have to return them, and do all these things. They would have to go to the British consul in regard to that. I could not give you all the ramifications on that. The articles end when the ship goes down.
SENATOR SMITH: I will ask you to hold yourself in readiness to resume the stand after the recess, Mr. Franklin: We will now take a recess until 3 o'clock.
Whereupon, at 1:30 o'clock p.m., a recess was taken until 3 o'clock p.m.
AFTERNOON SESSION.
The committee met, pursuant to the taking of recess, at 3:15 o'clock p.m., Hon. William Alden Smith (chairman) presiding.
THE CHAIRMAN: Mr. Franklin, will you kindly resume the stand? Senator Bourne have you finished?
SENATOR BOURNE: Yes.
SENATOR BURTON: Mr. Franklin, the Titanic was divided into 15 compartments by transverse partitions, as I understand it.
MR. FRANKLIN: Right.
SENATOR BURTON: Is there any way of telling how many of those different water­tight compartments were opened up by this collision, or what is your best estimate if there is no way of telling?
MR. FRANKLIN: I do not think there is any way of telling, from anything I have heard. You may find, in examining the officers ­ you might get some information on that subject, but I doubt if you will, and as far as I am concerned, I do not think you can estimate. I think ­ it might be a guess ­ five or six.
SENATOR BURTON: That is your best estimate?
MR. FRANKLIN: We can show you the general plan of the Olympic, which would show you those compartments.
SENATOR BURTON: Mr. Franklin, you were quoted in the papers of the afternoon of Monday as saying there was a sufficient number of lifeboats on the Titanic to take away all the passengers and crew on board ­ did you make any such statement as that?
MR. FRANKLIN: I do not remember making any statement of that kind, because I do not think anybody thought there were enough lifeboats to move the entire ship's company, passengers and crew, at the same time ­ to accommodate them all. Here are the various compartments [indicating plan]. Here is a plan of the steamer, showing the various compartments. How many of those were damaged and how many were admitting water immediately it is impossible for me to give you the slightest information. Anything I might say to you would simply be a guess.
SENATOR BURTON: That is all, Mr. Chairman.
SENATOR FLETCHER: I have just a few questions. When was the International Mercantile Marine Co. organized?
MR. FRANKLIN: In 1902, sir.
SENATOR FLETCHER: A foreign corporation?
MR. FRANKLIN: The International Mercantile Marine Co. is a New Jersey corporation.
SENATOR FLETCHER: You have held the position of vice president, then, since it was organized?
MR. FRANKLIN: Not immediately. My recollection is about six or seven months after the organization was completed.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Prior to that time were you connected with any shipping interests?
MR. FRANKLIN: I was connected with the Atlantic Transport Line, which is a subsidiary company of the International Mercantile Marine Co.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Your position is the highest office in that company in America?
MR. FRANKLIN: In America; yes, sir.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Mr. Ismay's official relation is what?
MR. FRANKLIN: He is president of that company.
SENATOR FLETCHER: He is managing director, also, of the White Star Line?
MR. FRANKLIN: Of the Oceanic Steam Navigation Co., which is the White Star Line.
SENATOR FLETCHER: This position of managing director is one which rather combines both the duties of a president and also a general manager of a corporation, does it not?
MR. FRANKLIN: Yes, sir; he is the head of that particular corporation, absolutely.
SENATOR FLETCHER: So that he was the highest official of that corporation on board the Titanic at the time she went down?
MR. FRANKLIN: Right, sir.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Did you know when it was intended to have the Titanic arrive at New York?
MR. FRANKLIN: I had not the slightest idea. I never had any; advices on when the Titanic was expected to arrive in New York.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Your office had no communication, then, with respect to the time it was expected the Titanic would arrive?
MR. FRANKLIN: No, sir.
SENATOR FLETCHER: You heard nothing either from Belfast or from Southampton?
MR. FRANKLIN: From nobody.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Do you know whether or not the Titanic reported from time to time during the progress of the voyage to Southampton or Belfast?
MR. FRANKLIN: That I could not tell you. I would have no knowledge of that, whatsoever.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Would that be customary?
MR. FRANKLIN: She might report for the first day out to Southampton or Liverpool just where she was, as a matter of form.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Do you know whether the Olympic, for instance, reports on such a voyage as that?
MR. FRANKLIN: As a rule the steamers do not report except as they are arriving. After they have left the port, as a rule, they do not make any further reports. It is only with a view of being able to advise the friends of passengers, and so forth; regarding the meeting of the ship that that is done.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Do you know why the communication that was sent in to Cape Race was sent there rather than direct to your office in New York?
MR. FRANKLIN: For a long time these communications have been sent to the telegraph companies themselves with a view of that being the quickest way to send that information throughout to those who are interested, and report it to the papers, and the maritime exchanges, and so forth. A little later on frequently we get information; when the ship approaches Nantucket, for the sake of argument, or Siasconsett. We might then get a telegram ourselves from the captain saying he is in such and such a position and expects to arrive at Sandy Hook at such and such a time, so that we can make arrangements for receiving them at a dock and notify the friends of passengers. It is a pure matter of form; it is a routine business.
SENATOR FLETCHER: As I understand, about 20 minutes before 2 on Monday morning the reporter rang you up, and said that they had heard the Titanic was sinking, and this came through the steamship Virginian ­ that information?
MR. FRANKLIN: That was reported to me at the time.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Via Montreal?
MR. FRANKLIN: So it was reported to me.
SENATOR FLETCHER: Can you recall how long it was after that before you had confirmation of that report?
MR. FRANKLIN: As I say; I immediately got the dock. Then I at once got the Associated Press, who confirmed the report. Then I got Montreal on the telephone, and I would say in about an hour, or probably three­quarters of an hour, they confirmed that information over the telephone.
SENATOR FLETCHER: What line did the Olympic belong to?
MR. FRANKLIN: The Olympic belonged to the White Star Line.
SENATOR FLETCHER: And the Virginian?
MR. FRANKLIN: The Virginian belongs to the Allen Line.
SENATOR FLETCHER: That is a competing line?
MR. FRANKLIN: That is a competing line. When I say a "competing line," all trans­Atlantic lines are more or less competing, but it is a line running between Canada and England, as a general proposition. Some steamers go to Boston.
SENATOR FLETCHER: And the Baltic?
MR. FRANKLIN: The Baltic is a steamer owned by the White Star Line, the same line. The Baltic was bound east and had passed the scene of the disaster.
SENATOR FLETCHER: You spoke of your marine superintendent this morning, but you did not name him or give his address. Can you do that?
MR. FRANKLIN: That was in connection with the Board of Trade inspection, and the marine superintendent, who would have had charge of the Board of Trade inspection of this ship, would be the man located in Southampton. His name is Capt. Steele.
SENATOR FLETCHER: The home office of the White Star Line is where?
MR. FRANKLIN: In Liverpool.
SENATOR FLETCHER: The Titanic was registered where?
MR. FRANKLIN: I think she was registered in Liverpool.
SENATOR FLETCHER: That is all.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: Mr. Franklin, how did the speed of the Titanic compare with that of the Lusitania and the Mauretania?
MR. FRANKLIN: The speed of the Titanic, as I understand she was running, was between 3 and 4 miles less than the speed of the Mauretania and the Lusitania.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: Less than the maximum speed?
MR. FRANKLIN: Less than some of their average voyages, I am taking it, and it was never thought by anybody that the Titanic would anything like equal the speed of the Mauretania and the Lusitania; it was never expected by anyone.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: She had not been put up to her maximum speed on this occasion?
MR. FRANKLIN: My understanding is that she had never been run at her maximum speed.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: What is the customary speed of these fast steamers in going through fog?
MR. FRANKLIN: That is entirely under the control and the jurisdiction of the captain, and it is one man's opinion against another man's. It is what the captain of the steamer at the time thinks a prudent speed, considering the density of the fog, and so forth, and anything else he has to govern him.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: No rules regarding these matters are laid down by the steamship companies?
MR. FRANKLIN: Yes; the steamship companies have very stringent rules. I think the fairest thing is to read off the White Star Line rule covering just that sort of a point.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: Do you have rules covering the question of ice as well as fog?
MR. FRANKLIN: It covers everything that the commander thinks is in any way hazardous. It is a general rule.
SENATOR NEWLANDS: Read the rule.
MR. FRANKLIN: It is rule 101, Mr. Burlingham says. It is as follows:
