CP/M/CPM_CDROM.iso/simtel/archives/cpm/9008-1.txt

Text File | 1993-02-20 | 98.9 KB | 2,442 lines

 1-Aug-90 06:47:07-MDT,8253;000000000000
Mail-From: KPETERSEN created at  1-Aug-90 06:27:25
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed,  1 Aug 90 06:27:24 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #126
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Wed,  1 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  126

Today's Topics:
                     Availability of Apple CPM SW
                    Speed adjustment on a TM101-4
           what disk for an 80tk ds dd Tandon TM101-4 drive
                               Z-System
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 30 Jul 90 13:47:05 GMT
From: motcid![e-mail]  (Corey S. Wilner)
Subject: Availability of Apple CPM SW
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I own an Apple //e computer w/128K RAM and, of course, a Z-80 card.
I used to use Wordstar until Appleworks 3.0 came out and now that I
have access to the 'net', I wanted to find out about Apple CPM stuff
again.  Can anyone answer a question or two for me:

1)  What is the latest and greatest version of the operating system
that I can get for the Apple.  I heard rumors way back when that said
there was going to be a multitasking OS for the Apple?!  Also, where
can I get the OS from?

2)  What is a good source for Apple CPM software.  Does someone have a
catalog of SW available for the Apple out there?  Does anyone even care
about supporting the Apple CPM format? Anyone? Anyone?

Thanks in advance.

***********************************************
Corey S. Wilner    |  Give me a jingle:
Motorola Cellular  |   ..!uunet!motcid!wilner
708-632-7206       |
***********************************************
NOTE:  DO NOT MAIL TO !uunet!motcid!red!wilner
                                    ^^^
       We have been losing mail that way.  To
       Japan I believe...no joke!
***********************************************
If after 30 minutes of a card game you don't
know who the rube is, you are!

McAfee's Law of Physical Material Balance:
Matter can be neither created nor destroyed.
However, it can be lost!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Jul 90 14:13:56 -0400
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Speed adjustment on a TM101-4
Message-ID: <5A071F0D35050221-SCTNVE*EUDOH@sctnve>

> Date: Fri, 20 Jul 90 19:21 CDT
> From: LANCE TAGLIAPIETRA <[e-mail]>
> Subject: Speed adjustment on a TM101-4
> Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
>
> Hi,
>
> I have an 80tkds drive, a Tandon TM101-4, which is running a bit too slow.
> I cannot find a speed adjustment on this drive.  Can the speed be
> adjusted on this drive? and if so, how is it done.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Lance Tagliapietra    [e-mail] or [e-mail]

hi,

  well, if you're using Montezuma Micro CP/M, you should be able to change
 the drive speeds along with drive type, size, and quantity...through the
 configure program that comes with MM CP/M...
  it's the one before the one where you change and assign different drive
 types, and the menu there is kind of overlayed....

   you select the drive A - D and it should give you another menu stating
 the above spects on the drive which you can change...  it's all done by
 the software...

 by the way, I have a slightly rebuilt TRS-80 Model 4P with almost anything
 I could buy or build for it...

 later dude..
  A 2....
 ___________________________________________________________
( -->> [e-mail] <<--   Cyber Lab Consultant      )
(                                  Computer Operations      )
(     //!\\       \\\\\\\\   Southern College of Technology )
(    //   \\            !!                                  )
(   //!!!!!\\     ////////       \\  Etop Udoh  \\          )
(  //       \\    !!              \\   - A2 -    \\         )
( //         \\   \\\\\\\\                                  )
(              Sometimes you just gotta say "what the f*ck" )
(___________________________________________________________)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 31 Jul 90 13:47:44 -0400
From: [e-mail]
Subject: what disk for an 80tk ds dd Tandon TM101-4 drive
Message-ID: <5A071F0D1F130373-SCTNVE*EUDOH@sctnve>

> > INFO-CPM Digest V90 #123
> > What disk for an 80tk ds dd Tandon TM101-4 drive
> >Well, the subject about says it all.  I would like to know where I can get
> >disks which will work in my 96tpi 80tk ds dd Tandon TM101-4 drives which
> >Montezuma Micro CP/M will format to 820K.  I just bought a box of Kodak MD"-H
> >disks which are rated at 96tpi, but they do not format, every track fails
> >the verify pass.  These disks are made for high density drives (1.2Meg).
> >
> >In the past, I have found Radio Shack 80tk 5.25" disks to work well, and also
> >some brands of 48tpi disks.  What is different about the high density disks
> >that they will not work properly on my drives?
>
> Lance Tagliapietra   [e-mail] or [e-mail]

HI,

   I started using the 80tk 5.25" drives about 4 or 5 years ago, when a friend
  of mine and I bought a pair, just tto see if they would work...
  We first used them with Newdos/80, Dosplus, and then finally Montezuma Micro..

  We used regular 48tpi disks, and the drives never really complained...
  Generic ones are probably the best...not to put anyone down...
  Note:  if you get bad tracks after formatting with MM CP/M, you can lock out
        the bad tracks with the "findbad" program....and you normally just get
        a handful of bad tracks.

    the only way you can really go wrong with the drive is trying to write a
  another format with it, such as a 40 trk format, you can read them fine, but
  it is not recommended to write to them also...  You overlay every other track
  in a sense in other to be able to write the lesser format and it probably
  won't do it correctly after a time, or who knows what else could happen....
    Already lost one drive because of that....it's like it just slowly went out
    of alignment....

 later dude...
 A 2...
 ___________________________________________________________
( -->> [e-mail] <<--   Cyber Lab Consultant      )
(                                  Computer Operations      )
(     //!\\       \\\\\\\\   Southern College of Technology )
(    //   \\            !!                                  )
(   //!!!!!\\     ////////       \\  Etop Udoh  \\          )
(  //       \\    !!              \\   - A2 -    \\         )
( //         \\   \\\\\\\\                                  )
(              Sometimes you just gotta say "what the f*ck" )
(___________________________________________________________)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 27 Jul 90 14:32:30 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: Z-System

After the Amstrad discuss here, Peter da Silva asked me:

>> What is the Z system? Is it available for non-Amstrad CP/M boxes?

   Z-System is an advanced CP/M-compatible operating system with such
features as:

    multiple commands on a line
    powerful scripting/aliasing capability
    search path for requested commands and files
    error trapping and recovery
    Unix-like TCAP for terminal-independent full-screen operations
    command processor shells including history shells
    wordprocessor-like command line editing
    flow control commands (multilevel IF/THEN/ELSE processing)
    reloadable, user-selectable resident commands
    named directories
    security (great for remote-access systems)

It has been available for many years for CP/M-2.2 machines.  Only in the
past two years did we figure out how to get it to run on CP/M-Plus computers
as well.  We now have commercial versions that install automatically, can be
reconfigured easily, and even allow the configuration to be changed on the
fly.  If you send me a mailing address, I would be happy to send you some
information.

-- Jay Sage


------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #126
*************************************
 4-Aug-90 11:33:06-MDT,14183;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat,  4 Aug 90 11:15:29 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #127
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Sat,  4 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  127

Today's Topics:
                           CP/M ftp sites?
                   How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
                          Osborne portables
                       Osborne portables II...
                    ZCPR 3.3 extended environment?
                 ZCPR 3.3 FAST ERA/REN/PROT algorithm
                      ZCPR 3.3 Named Directories
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 1 Aug 90 14:55:53 GMT
From: media-lab!snorkelwacker!spdcc!merk!alliant!linus!nixbur!nixpbe!peun11![e-mail]  (Moellers)
Subject: CP/M ftp sites?
Message-ID: <josef.649522553@peun11>

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Magnus Olsson) writes:

>Does anyone know of any ftp sites with CP/M programs? The only one I've
>heard of so far is Simtel20.
            ^^^^^^^^
... and still not enough??

--
| Josef Moellers        |    c/o Nixdorf Computer AG    |
|  USA: [e-mail]    |    Abt. PXD-S14        |
| !USA: [e-mail]    |    Heinz-Nixdorf-Ring    |
| Phone: [phone]    |    D-4790 Paderborn    |

------------------------------

Date: 31 Jul 90 16:02:55 GMT
From: hpda!hpcuha!aspen!hpcc01!hpbbn!hpbbrd!hpfcmdd!hpfcso!hpldola!hp-lsd![e-mail]  (Bill Stubblebine)
Subject: How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I have a question for any Ampro Little Board Z80+ BIOS hackers still left
out there.

My configuration:

    Ampro LB Z80+ (w/built-in SCSI interface)
    Adaptec ACB4000 (not 4000A) SCSI hard disk controller
    Seagate ST-125 20 MB 40 ms hard disk drive
    3M MCD-403 40 MB QIC SCSI tape drive
    NZ-COM/Z-System

I've used this system for several years.  Until recently, I've never had
reason to complain about the speed of the LB+ BIOS SCSI routines talking to
my hard disk because most programs and editor text load within human
tolerance limits, i.e., < ~1-3 seconds.

Recently, I purchased the 3M MCD-403 SCSI tape drive to support backups.
It was a good deal for $129 surplus at Halted Electronics in Sunnyvale.
The tape drive works great, and the Ampro BIOS provides a convenient
virtual machine for accessing the SCSI bus.  Within a very short time I was
able to exercise the tape drive's basic features via SCSI.

As I started transferring real data between the hard disk and the tape
drive, I discovered that I could not source or sink data from the hard disk
fast enough to keep the tape drive streaming.  (Streaming means keeping the
tape drive motor continuously running during data transfers.)  Without
maintaining streaming operation, the tape transport stops, repositions the
tape and starts up again to read or write each physical block on the tape.
Because this extra positioning activity will probably reduce the life of
the tape transport, it looks like I need to speed up the hard disk accesses
slightly.

A few more details on the tape drive.  The tape drive reads and writes 8k
byte physical blocks.  A single SCSI command can transfer multiple 8k
blocks to or from the tape, but never less than one block.  To keep the
tape drive streaming the host needs to request a read, write or seek
operation from the tape drive within 250ms of a prior read, write or seek
operation, otherwise the tape drive motor shuts down automatically.

A few more details on the disk drive and controller.  The Adaptec ACB4000
controller formats the ST-125 using 18 512-byte physical sectors (or
logical blocks as the controller manual refers to them) per physical track.
Thus, one physical track on the disk contains 72 logical (128-byte) CP/M
sectors, with four 128-byte CP/M sectors per each 512-byte SCSI logical
block.  The Ampro BIOS computes CP/M sector and track numbers based on 64
128-byte sectors per track, and converts the CP/M track/sector numbers into
SCSI Logical Block Addresses (LBAs) as part of processing BIOS read, write
and seek requests.  I mention this so that in the following discussion when
I refer to logical sectors, you will know that I am not talking about CP/M
sectors and tracks, but logical 512-byte SCSI logical blocks.

The SCSI logical blocks are physically positioned in relation to each other
on the track based on the interleave factor specified to the Adaptec
controller at format time.  The Adaptec controller supports interleave
factors from 1:1 to 9:1, i.e., the fastest interleave (1:1) is when
sequential logical sectors occupy adjacent physical locations on the track,
while the slowest interleave (9:1) has eight physical SCSI sectors between
each logical SCSI sector.

The ST-125 spins at 3600 RPM = 60 RPS => 16.67 ms/ revolution.  Thus, the
drive has a basic latency of 16.67/2=8.33 ms, i.e., the average time you
need to wait before the desired physical block arrives under the head,
assuming, of course that the head is positioned over the desired track.

I've spent some time characterizing the hard disk operation.  To my
surprise, even with the ST-125 formatted at the slowest interleave (9:1),
the BIOS cannot transfer the contents of a 512-byte SCSI logical sector in
time to read the next SCSI logical sector on the same track nine sectors
away.  In fact, careful measurement revealed that after reading a SCSI
sector, at 9:1 interleave the the BIOS **just misses** the next available
logical sector, and has to wait for the next revolution.

For example, after reading physical sector 1, the nearest physical sector
that the BIOS can read on the same track during the same rotation is
physical sector 11 as illustrated below:

    One track:   <--------------------- 16.67 ms -------------------->
    Physical:    01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18
    Logical:     01 03 05 07 09 11 13 15 17 02 04 06 08 10 12 14 16 18
    One sector:  <---------- 8.33 ms ------->

I did these experiments using bona fide BIOS calls just as an application
program would.  I transferred each 512-byte SCSI block to memory using four
sequential CP/M sector requests starting with the CP/M sector that mapped
onto the first of the four CP/M sectors in the SCSI physical block.
(Believe me, that was an interesting exercise in integer programming.)  I
timed the SCSI block transfer starting from just before the first CP/M
sector request till just after the fourth sequential CP/M request.  These
were BIOS sector reads and writes - no BDOS overhead was involved.

I realize that reading 4 CP/M sectors per SCSI sector involves overhead in
the BIOS deblocking code.  I estimated the overhead of the deblocking code
by measuring the time to transfer a 128 byte CP/M sector I knew was already
buffered in the BIOS deblocker.  This took a little less than 1 ms per CP/M
sector - not fast, but also nowhere near the 8ms+ required for the entire
512 SCSI block.  The results indicate that the BIOS is taking > ~4ms to
read a measly 512 bytes per physical SCSI sector.

Overall, the net throughput of the Ampro SCSI HD interface seems lower than
it should be.  The best it can do is four 128 byte CP/M sectors per 16.6 ms
disk revolution, or 512 bytes/16.6ms.  Thus, even with a 1:1 interleave so
that logical sector 2 is right next to logical sector 1, transferring 8k
bytes requires:

    (8192/512 sectors)*16.67 ms/sector = 16*16.67 = 266.72 ms

    This equates to only 30,713 bytes per second net throughput from
    the hard disk - not too impressive in my opinion.

Add to this any randomness in a file's disk allocation involving head seek
time, and I'm out of the ball park for streaming.

If I could speed up the processing of a SCSI logical sector by one or two
milliseconds, I could double the throughput at an interleave of 9:1,
because the BIOS could transfer two SCSI logical sectors per revolution
instead of 1 SCSI sector per revolution as it does now.

If you're still with me, I wonder if anyone has managed to get more than
30.7K bytes per second net throughput to/from the hard disk out of a
configuration similar to mine.  I've read the Ampro BIOS source and the
Adaptec technical manual several times without finding a clue to speeding
things up further.  What's the trick?

                                Bill Stubblebine
                                Hewlett-Packard Logic Systems Div.
                                [e-mail]  (Internet)
                                [phone]

------------------------------

Date: 2 Aug 90 02:09:09 GMT
From: godzilla.cis.ohio-state.edu![e-mail]  (william c ray)
Subject: Osborne portables
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

HELP!!!

I work for a VERY poor research lab... we hdon't have enough money to buy
new machines, so we scrounge what we can from surplus... Well, I just came
across 2 (supposedly functional) Osborne portable machines, which from all
appearances have IEEE488 interfaces (wow!)...  Trouble is, they don't have
any of the docs, or software (not even boot/OS)... We would love to get these
things functional, to use as data acquisition controllers w/ the IEEE488.

So, does anyone have one of these?  Could you *Please* send me copies of
manuals, software, information on these?  (I did pick the right group, right?
they are CPM machines aren't they?)  We would be more than happy to pay
duplication/postage/etc costs.

thanks
Will Ray
[e-mail]
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 3 Aug 90 17:34:10 GMT
From: wizard.cis.ohio-state.edu![e-mail]  (william c ray)
Subject: Osborne portables II...
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Thanks to the people who  have
replied to my query, I now know that there are different types of
osborne portables... well, it seems that I have 2 different versions of
the OS-1 (actually, the  plate on the newer of the two lists  it as  an OCC-1).
So, if anyone has  the software for one of these contraptions,
PLEASE (please please please be listening)  let me know.  I would very much
appreciate  copies of anything that can be knownn about, or run on  the machine.

thanks Will Ray
[e-mail]
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 2 Aug 90 08:49:18 edt
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: ZCPR 3.3 extended environment?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

CEO summary:
I have an installation of ZCPR 3.3 that I am trying to get different
utilities running for.  However, with SHOW I get the message
"extended environment required" and with ZEX I get "inadequate
facilities".  I have everything implemented--RCPs, IOPs, FCPs,
external environment, termcap, named directories, external command
line, external stack, etc. etc.  First of all, what is the extended
environment--mine is based on SYSENV.LBR (which seems to be cludgey
at best), where am I supposed to get a proper environment information?

Thanks. [e-mail]




------------------------------

Date: Thu, 2 Aug 90 09:00:26 edt
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: ZCPR 3.3 FAST ERA/REN/PROT algorithm
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

CEO summary:
I just recently moved from my own (very system dependent) command
processor replacement to ZCPR 3.3.  One thing that I noticed is that
commands such as ERA, REN, PROT and any other program that work to
modify the directory can be made to work a lot faster than they
already are.  From what I can tell, ERA will first scan the directory
using the search and next functions, and the delete each file
individually with the delete command.  This requires that the
directory be scaned once no matter what, and once for each file to be
deleted.  The faster way for the simple ERA would to be scan the
directory using the search and next functions, but when I directory
entry is found, print it, change the user to E5 and then to a BIOS
write.  BIOS is already set to the correct DMA, track, and sector
because of the read to get that sector there in the first place.
This way the directory is read once (very fast).  For more complex
operations such as querying for verification, read the directory
once, perform the queries, and then scan a second time, changing only
the files that the user has allowed to be changed.  Has anybody
thought to do this?  How about getting it changed (I might be able to
do it myself, but I need info on getting this tested and distributed)?
Thanks. [e-mail]



------------------------------

Date: Thu, 2 Aug 90 08:53:18 edt
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: ZCPR 3.3 Named Directories
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

CEO summary:
I have been having problems with named directories under ZCPR 3 since
I began installing it.  The problem lies with the LDR, and I think I
have discovered where.  With the Z3BASE.LIB, I specify the number of
entries that I want (used default of 14) and the size of the buffer
is then 18*entries+1.  However, looking into the Z3LIB routines, the
information it provides is the number of 128 byte blocks that the
named directory is. What seems to be happening is that when I load
the named directory, it winds up clobbering the command line.  It
seems to me here that something is in conflict, and it is the Z3LIB
(and all programs that use it, including LDR) are wrong.  Can someone
please give me some input as to what number should be in the
environment (entries or 128 byte blocks) and how does Z3LIB get the
number of 128 byte blocks of the number of entries.

Thanks. [e-mail]




------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #127
*************************************
 8-Aug-90 12:25:17-MDT,8970;000000000000
Mail-From: KPETERSEN created at  8-Aug-90 12:16:54
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed,  8 Aug 90 12:16:53 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #128
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Wed,  8 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  128

Today's Topics:
                           CP/M-UG Hamburg
               How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI? (2 msgs)
                          KAYPRO 10 forsale
                    Z80 assembler recommendations
                          zcpr 3.3 questions
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 3 Aug 90 21:01:40 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ira.uka.de!smurf!gopnbg!mcshh![e-mail]  (Edmund Ramm)
Subject: CP/M-UG Hamburg
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Das naechste Treffen der  CP/M User Group Hamburg findet statt
am Sonnabend, dem 11. August 1990 um 1500h in Torstens Rechen-
zentrum, Parallelstrasse 6a, 2000 Norderstedt. Gaeste sind wie
immer gern gesehen.

Edmund Ramm, DK3UZ, Anderheitsallee 24, 2000 Hamburg 71, [phone] voice
    uunet!mcsun!unido!mcshh!dk3uz    or    uunet!mcsun!unido!cosmo!dk3uz
-->

Edmund Ramm, DK3UZ, Anderheitsallee 24, 2000 Hamburg 71, [phone] voice
    uunet!mcsun!unido!mcshh!dk3uz    or    uunet!mcsun!unido!cosmo!dk3uz

------------------------------

Date: 6 Aug 90 18:29:22 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!bu.edu!orc!inews!cadev6![e-mail]  (Doug Braun ~)
Subject: How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bill Stubblebine) writes:
>I have a question for any Ampro Little Board Z80+ BIOS hackers still left
>out there.
>
>My configuration:
>
>    Ampro LB Z80+ (w/built-in SCSI interface)
>    Adaptec ACB4000 (not 4000A) SCSI hard disk controller
>    Seagate ST-125 20 MB 40 ms hard disk drive
>    3M MCD-403 40 MB QIC SCSI tape drive
>    NZ-COM/Z-System
>
.
.
.
>
>If you're still with me, I wonder if anyone has managed to get more than
>30.7K bytes per second net throughput to/from the hard disk out of a
>configuration similar to mine.  I've read the Ampro BIOS source and the
>Adaptec technical manual several times without finding a clue to speeding
>things up further.  What's the trick?
>

Since you are already directly accessing the SCSI bus to run the tape drive,
you should do the same to access the disk.  You could then read at least
32K at a time from the disk.  In my UZI system, I swapped 32K bytes at a time.
My hardware was a 4MHz Z80, a custom-built (simple) SCSI host adapter
that used a Z80-DMA chip, a Shugart SCSI to ST-506 controller, and a
hard disk with 8 heads.  I was able to use a 2:1 interleave.  With
this setup, it takes about 4 revolutions to read 32K, which is ~68 ms.
Allowing 2 ms for overhead, this gives you thruput of over 450K bytes/sec.
The DMA chip allows me to read data fast enough for this.  If you have to use
programmed I/O, you will not do as well, had have to use a bigger interleave.

With all these SCSI disk controllers, if you do many small reads instead
of one large one, the overhead time will dominate the transfer time.
I noticed on my CP/M BIOS, which uses 1K transfers (2 disk sectors at a time),
that the performance is essentially independent of the disk interleave.

With your tape setup, if you read 8k from disk, and write it to tape,
you might keep the drive streaming msot of the time.  If not, you could
at least read 32K, and write 4 tape blocks per start/stop.
Beware. If you always let almost 250 ms go by between writing tape blocks,
you may have very large interrecord gaps, which will reduce your tape capacity.

I have dealt with most of these issues while interfacing a Memtec drive
to my system.

Doug Braun                Intel Corp CAD
                    408 765-4279

 / decwrl \
 | hplabs |
-| oliveb |- !intelca!mipos3!cadev4!dbraun
 | amd    |
 \ qantel /

 or:

 [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 6 Aug 90 21:52:43 GMT
From: mentor.cc.purdue.edu!descartes.math.purdue.edu![e-mail]  (Clarence Wilkerson)
Subject: How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Could you implement "scsi device to scsi device" transfer without having
to go through
the CPU? This is possible under some circumstances ( e.g. two disks on
same controller ),
but I'm not sure of the generality.

------------------------------

Date: 6 Aug 90 21:27:39 GMT
From: hpda!hpcupt1!hprnd!hprmokg![e-mail]  (Gregory Holdren)
Subject: KAYPRO 10 forsale
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

       I have a KAYPRO 10 for sale. It is complete and is in excellent
       condition.

       o 4 MHz Z80, 64k of RAM
       o 390k floppy drive, 10Mb Harddrive
       o Built in 9" green screen w/some graphics capabilities
       o Removable keyboard (folds up to the face of the unit)
       o Portable unit with handle

       o All original manuals and system disks.
       o Turbo Pascal 3.30
       o BDS C Compiler Ver 1.6
       o NZCOM (Self installing ZCPR34) latest version as of May 90.
       o KayPro software package includes: WordStar 3.3, Dbase II, Mite
     others too,,, can't think of the others.

       o asking $300, you pay shipping or pick up.
       o Voice number [phone] or respond to Greg Holdren
                           [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 7 Aug 90 21:04:13 GMT
From: stan!dancer![e-mail]  (Warner Losh)
Subject: Z80 assembler recommendations
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I need recommendations for a Z80 assembler that handles Zilog
Mnemonics.  I have a BIOS-oid (for a DEC Rainbow, if that matters)
that I need to assemble.  The assembler should be able to do the
following:

    1) Macro expansion

        With arguments like ?Name, ?Size

    2) Label folding

        Similar to the way that PDP-11 and VAX MACRO works.
        Namely, labels that are numberic followed by a "$"
        are discarded at the next non-temp label.  The
        following code should work:

        foo:    ld    A,8
        10$:    JP    C,20$
            JP    N,10$
        20$:    ld    A,(HL)
            XOR    A
        bar:    LD    A,(IX+1)
            LD    B,(IX)
            LD    C,10
        10$:    OUT    (40H),A
            DJNZ    10$

    3) Support for IF, TITLE and ORG

    4) Ability to produce binary image file

This can run on a Sun 4, MS-DOS (Rainbow), CP/M-80 or CP/M-86.
Pointers to a writeup on all the ones available would be nice.  I know
about simtel20.army.mil, but I couldn't find a writeup on what was
available.  Most of the files in the PD2:<CPM.ASMUTIL> directory had
the description:"No description available".

Warner

--
Warner Losh        [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Aug 90 13:44:58 PDT
From: Bridger Mitchell <[e-mail]>
Subject: zcpr 3.3 questions
Message-ID: <9008062045.AA00560@newton>

Dan,

In general, a number of the problems you are running into in
installing ZCPR 3.3have been solved or superceded by the current
Z-System version (3.4) and associated tools and relocatable libraries.
If you check with one of these Z-Nodes you will find a wealth of
current info.

213-670-9465    (Ladera Heights, CA)
617-965-7259    (Newton Centre MA, password ='DDT')

The most extensive documentation and notes on the Z-System are to be
found in issues of The Computer Journal and in specific directories on
the Z-Node remote CP/M systems.  I don't have specific references
at hand.

The extended environment includes addresses of the ZCPR, BDOS and
BIOS; it is described in columns by both Jay Sage and myself some
issues back.  In a zcpr 3.4 compatible system those addresses would
either already be assembled into the ENV segment, or they would be
installed when the dynamic Z-System is loaded/booted.  Also, the
JetLDR tool which comes with NZCOM and Z3PLUS automatically converts
an older external environment into an extended one whenever it is used
to load a system segment.

---------

It is possible to ERA, REN, PROT, and MOVE directory entries with
direct BIOS writes.  However, this approach should be avoided in any
general-purpose tool, and certainly in a (resident) command processor.
The reason is that the host system might well mount another type of
file system, such as DosDisk (which allows one to use MS-DOS disks
transparently on a CP/M system).  In that case, an ERA command would
likely damage some crucual part of the dos disk.  There are also some
specific technicalities one needs to beware of, including multiple
directory extents.

-- bridger

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #128
*************************************
14-Aug-90 07:23:03-MDT,7656;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 14 Aug 90 07:15:10 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #129
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Tue, 14 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  129

Today's Topics:
                     Anyone got a CCS boot disk?
                      CompuPro 8/16 curiosities
              CPM utilities - Melbourne.OZ readers only
                  Help needed with TeleVideo TS-804
                   Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud (2 msgs)
                            Osborne help?
                    SuperBrain BIOS source wanted
                Thanks and FAST ERA/REN/PROT continued
                            VT220 Emulator
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 8 Aug 90 20:44:25 GMT
From: hpda!hpcupt1!hprnd!hprmokg![e-mail]  (Bill Hooper)
Subject: Anyone got a CCS boot disk?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I tried to respond via email but it ket bouncing. Anyway I have a CCS
system and the source code you are looking for. I would be more than
willing to arrange a swap for software.

Bill Hooper
[e-mail]
(w) [phone]

------------------------------

Date: 14 Aug 90 09:59:47 GMT
From: pacbell.com!pacbell!sactoh0!ijpc![e-mail]  (Ian Justman)
Subject: CompuPro 8/16 curiosities
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Just wondering, is there a Unix-type operating system for the CompuPro 8/16?
If so, I would love to know about it!

Thanks in advance.

------------------------------

Date: 13 Aug 90 06:23:46 GMT
From: munnari.oz.au!goanna!minyos![e-mail]  (Quentin van Abbe)
Subject: CPM utilities - Melbourne.OZ readers only
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

 I'm posting this for a contact with no net access in Melbourne. Anyone
 who can reply please contact him direct - Mr Walter Tiedemann
                       Telephone [phone]

    He is looking for CPM utilities, in particular a general purpose
    file undeletion routine, is all I can tell you.

------------------------------

Date: 14 Aug 90 09:58:09 GMT
From: pacbell.com!pacbell!sactoh0!ijpc![e-mail]  (Ian Justman)
Subject: Help needed with TeleVideo TS-804
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] writes:

> Out of curiosity, is it still possible to get MP/M?

I doubt it now.

------------------------------

Date: 14 Aug 90 00:41:40 GMT
From: ncsuvm![e-mail]
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

  I have a Kaypro 4, 1983 model and a 2400 Baud modem.  My problem is, at
2400 baud, it tends to drop characters.
Thus:

Enter username>

becomes

Etsernme>

Is this a problem of software or hardware? How do I solve this problem?
I have this difficulty with MODEM7+, YAMKAP, and CP4KPR.

It is silly to have to use 1200 baud when I can go much faster.

------------------------------

Date: 14 Aug 90 10:50:52 GMT
From: swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!munnari.oz.au!bunyip!iceman![e-mail]  (Ross Alford)
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

>   I have a Kaypro 4, 1983 model and a 2400 Baud modem.  My problem is, at
> 2400 baud, it tends to drop characters.
I also have an '83 series Kaypro 4.  It seems to cope just fine with
terminal emulation using MEX at up to 4800 baud, if my memory serves
me right.  Now that I think about it, though, that may be because I doubled
the clock speed using the Micro Cornucopia hardware mod some years ago,
so it runs at 5 Mhz.  Many old Kaypros have had this or a similar mod done,
but if yours hasn't that could be one solution to the problem.  You could
also try getting an interrupt-driven terminal emulator.  There is at least
one on SIMTEL20, in the PD1:<CPM.KAYPRO> (might be wrong about it being PD1,
could be PD2?) directory.  Micro Cornucopia used to sell one on one of their
disks, but since they seem to have gone out of business, I guess that is no
longer a viable source.

Ross Alford
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 9 Aug 90 23:31 PDT
From: Steven Russell <[e-mail]>
Subject: Osborne help?

Not long ago, someone posted a request for an Osborne 1 boot disk.  I might
be able to help, but I have lost the name and address of the author of the
plea.  So, to that needy person:  If you still need help, drop me a note
and I will see what I can do.

-Steven Russell
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 11 Aug 90 10:00:21 GMT
From: usc!cs.utexas.edu!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!clyde.concordia.ca!ccu.umanitoba.ca![e-mail]  (Dan Fandrich)
Subject: SuperBrain BIOS source wanted
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Does anyone have the soruce to the SuperBrain I BIOS?  I have half of it,
but apparently Intertec didn't release the other half (the fun low-level
stuff).  Of course, look where Intertec is (or isn't) today.  Serves them
right! :-)  I'd love to get ZCPR going on my machine, but without full BIOS
sources that's next to impossible.  I'd hate to disassemble my BIOS and
find out it's already been done.

>>> Dan
--
CDNnet:     [e-mail]
Compu$erve: 72365,306
FidoNet:    Dan Fandrich at 1:153/511.1

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 8 Aug 90 17:30:56 edt
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: Thanks and FAST ERA/REN/PROT continued
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

CEO summary:
Thanks to everyone who has given me more information about ZCPR 3.4.
I now have it up an running (although I have not used NZCOM, just
what comes from simtel20).  The funny thing, is that now that I read
some of The Computer Journal articles, I find that I had pretty much
reinvented NZCOM on my system (mine doesn't do automatic relocation,
but everything is almost the same, although mine is a little better
for QX-10s).
  I finally looked back at the named directories, and making them pad
out to sector sizes worked fine.  As for the environment, I already
had the new environment, its just that the code was wrong.  Could
someone give me a summary of the environment types and what they
mean??
  As for the FAST ERA/REN/PROT, the point that other things such as
DosDisk would have problems is a good point (lbrdisk is another one).
As far as other things go--I am fully aware about extents and the
such (I have been hacking around CP/M since ZCPR 1.0!).  A "general
purpose" utility could be written that either does things
conventionally or using this fast mode by making a check on the
drive.  Are there any suggestions on making this check (other than an
environment byte)?  Thanks.



------------------------------

Date: 13 Aug 90 02:16:28 GMT
From: clyde.concordia.ca!NSTN!utgpu!watserv1!vlsi![e-mail]  (Todd Schneider)
Subject: VT220 Emulator
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Does anyone know where I can get a VT220 terminal emulator for a CP/M
machine? Anything - freeware, shareware or commercial is acceptable.
Please reply by e-mail as I am not a regular reader of this group.
If there is interest I will post a summary.

Thanks,
Todd.
([e-mail])

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #129
*************************************
16-Aug-90 04:23:48-MDT,9801;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Thu, 16 Aug 90 04:15:08 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #130
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Thu, 16 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  130

Today's Topics:
                    86-88 MicroSys Journals Cheap
                CP/M on the C128 and secondary devices
   Is there space in bank 0 that can be used for a small RAM disk?
                      Kaypro 10 and Even Parity
                   Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud (3 msgs)
                       SuperBrain BIOS and ZCPR
                              UNZIP.LBR
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed 15 Aug 90 09:48:44-EST
From: Gern <[e-mail]>
Subject: 86-88 MicroSys Journals Cheap
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I am looking for a good home to my collection of Sol Libes's MicroSystems/
Journal magazines.  I have complete issues from JAN/FEB 86 (Vol 2 #1) to
DEC 88 (VOL 4 #12) - 24 issues in all.   Say $5.00 to cover shipping to
anywhere in the US to the first person who REALLY wants them.

Cheers,
Gern
-------

------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 19:36:15 GMT
From: ogicse!zephyr.ens.tek.com!orca.wv.tek.com!pogo![e-mail]  (Rick Clements)
Subject: CP/M on the C128 and secondary devices
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Is there a way to access a printer and specify the secondary address?  On the
printer I have, the only way to access several of the features by setting the
secondary address. :-( BASIC in C64 or C128 mode is about the only way to
access these features. )-:  My plotter has the same problem.
--
Rick Clements ([e-mail])

------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 19:28:30 GMT
From: ogicse!zephyr.ens.tek.com!orca.wv.tek.com!pogo![e-mail]  (Rick Clements)
Subject: Is there space in bank 0 that can be used for a small RAM disk?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I have a C128 and would like to use any free space in bank zero as a RAM disk.
I shells that come with my two C compilers (for 128 mode) both have about 48K
available.  Does anyone know how much space is available?  Any tips on setting
it up would be appreciated.
--
Rick Clements ([e-mail])

------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 18:36:54 GMT
From: fed!macs2![e-mail]  (Thomas C. Allard)
Subject: Kaypro 10 and Even Parity
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Can anyone tell me how to set even parity on a Kaypro with a Incomm 2400
baud modem.  I'm running Mex+ and when I use the set parity even command
I can no longer talk to the modem port.  I suspect that this is merely
changing the way which Mex talks to the port but not the port itself.
When I log onto the fed's netserver at no parity (it expects even) I can
still send SOME characters but half are filtered.  I can send most of
the alphabet (half uppercase, the rest lower).  I'd tell the server to
set no parity, but the equal sign is blocked.  When I use Mex+ to set
even parity I can't even issue an AT command and switching after the
connection doesn't help either.

rgds-- TA (fed!m1tca00)

------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 18:31:31 GMT
From: fed!macs2![e-mail]  (Thomas C. Allard)
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] writes:
|>
|>  I have a Kaypro 4, 1983 model and a 2400 Baud modem.  My problem is, at
|>2400 baud, it tends to drop characters.
|>Thus:
|>
|>Enter username>
|>
|>becomes
|>
|>Etsernme>
|>
|>Is this a problem of software or hardware? How do I solve this problem?
|>I have this difficulty with MODEM7+, YAMKAP, and CP4KPR.
|>
|>It is silly to have to use 1200 baud when I can go much faster.

Make sure that your 25th status line is off.  When it is on the machine
has to redraw the screen when scrolling and doesn't have time to keep
up.  I think the sequence is ESC-C-7.

------------------------------

Date: 16 Aug 90 01:19:56 GMT
From: ncsuvm![e-mail]
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Thanks for the info.   I am still running at 2.5MHz, does anyone know
If I can get a clock speed upgrade to 5 or 8 MHz? and If so, from where
and how much It will cost me?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Monty: You're SURE you finished?   | BITNET:NETOPRDW AT NCSUVM
Gadget: Sure I'm sure.             | internet:[e-mail]
Monty: Not like the Last time?     |_____________________________________
Gadget: Oh, Monty, How many times can the wings fall off a plane?

------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 18:32:49 GMT
From: munnari.oz.au!sirius.ucs.adelaide.edu.au!levels![e-mail]
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
>
>   I have a Kaypro 4, 1983 model and a 2400 Baud modem.  My problem is, at
> 2400 baud, it tends to drop characters.
> Thus:
>
> Enter username>
>
> becomes
>
> Etsernme>

I am well aware of how this makes you feel. . .

> Is this a problem of software or hardware?

It's a hardware problem.

> How do I solve this problem?

Get in touch with the people at Microcornucopia Magazine in Bend, OR.
They offered a complete range of new monitor ROMs that use advanced video
command sequences.  This would allow the Z80 to do less video housekeeping
(ie. more character buffering) and you'll get to keep your current setup.

> I have this difficulty with MODEM7+, YAMKAP, and CP4KPR.

I have it with ZMP, Kermit, and MDM730 (basically everything serial!)

> It is silly to have to use 1200 baud when I can go much faster.

Tell me about it!  I hear the '84 series (mine) with graphics is even slower
hence my knowledge about this.  I can't even go 1200 with my Hayes without
nulls on the BBS I'm calling!  Unfortunately, nowadays, nobody needs nulls
(but me!!!)  My MOD involved a new ROM (PRO-MAX884 = $79.00 US) and a 2MHz
68B45 chip from Motorola.  No worries at all.  Works beautifully!  Even gives
me current time & date on the 25th line (status line) CONSTANTLY!  VT52
Terminal emulation (H89, etc.) and Screen dump, & much more. (ZCPR in ROM)

If you want an address or a few more references to articles in uC, let me know
by email.
 Good luck  . . . . Ronn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:14:33 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: SuperBrain BIOS and ZCPR

   Dan Fandrich said, "I'd love to get ZCPR going on my machine, but without
full BIOS sources that's next to impossible."

   Not so on several accounts!  First, with NZCOM you can have a full Z-
System running in a matter of minutes on just about any CP/M-2.2 computer,
including the SuperBrain.  There is no need to tinker with the BIOS at all.

   Second, if you are not willing to spend the money for NZCOM and you have
MOVCPM for your machine, you can use it to create a version of CP/M with
some free memory above the top of the BIOS (relocated downward).  After
that, it is not terribly difficult to patch the BIOS coldboot code to
initialize the ZCPR buffers and to replace the CP/M CCP with ZCPR3x.  You
still won't have as flexible and configurable a system this way, but I did
this many times before Joe Wright came up with the autoinstall concept used
in NZCOM.

   Even if you don't have MOVCPM, there is still hope.  As the owner of the
QX-10 mentioned here recently (sorry, I did not note his name), you can
fairly easily create your own simplified version of NZCOM for your
particular installation.  You would boot CP/M and then run your own loader
program that would install the virtual BIOS some distance below the real
BIOS entry point.  I described this in some detail in a TCJ column about two
years ago.

-- Jay Sage


------------------------------

Date: 15 Aug 90 23:06:38 GMT
From: bu.edu!snorkelwacker!spdcc!mirror!pallio![e-mail]  (David Goodenough)
Subject: UNZIP.LBR
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

An apology and a request.

Firstly, my apologies to all who have come across my original UNZIP.LBR
(the one without the source). The source is now included, and has been
uploaded to a couple of BBS's here in Boston (from whence it will
doubtless spread like wildfire :-) ). In addition UNZIP.ZY is up on GEnie
in the CP/M RT libraries, and the correct UNZIP.LBR is available from
the rna server here at pallio.

If you need to get at the server, send mail containing the following two
lines:

/send help to your_address
/send index to your_address

to pallio!rna, where 'your_address' gets replaced by either a valid Internet
address ([e-mail] type thing), or a bang path from a backbone site.

Secondly, UNZIP as it currently is only handles Shrinking, Reducing and
Imploding (i.e. PKZIP102). I gather that there is a new compression method
out there for PKZIP110, does anyone know anything about it, or (preferably)
where I can get C source for a decompressor.
--
    [e-mail] - David Goodenough        +---+
                        IHS    | +-+-+
    ..... !harvard!xait!pallio!dg            +-+-+ |
AKA:    [e-mail]              +---+

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #130
*************************************
20-Aug-90 07:25:52-MDT,4607;000000000000
Mail-From: KPETERSEN created at 20-Aug-90 07:18:08
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 90 07:18:08 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #131
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Mon, 20 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  131

Today's Topics:
                             Docs wanted
                      Kaypro 10 and Even Parity
                        Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 17 Aug 90 09:49:25 GMT
From: pacbell.com!pacbell!sactoh0!ijpc![e-mail]  (Ian Justman)
Subject: Docs wanted
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I would like documentation on the following items (or information):

CompuPro System Support 1
CompuPro Interfacer 3
CompuPro Disk 1A
CompuPro Disk 3 (I'll explain in a bit)
CompuPro M-Drive/H

For the CompuPro Disk 3, I'm having troubles using one on my Z80 S100
box, a Dynabyte DB8/1.  It's supposed to use DMA, and it doesn't seem
to be communicating to the bus properly.  If anyone has worked on any
code for the Disk 3, source (pref. in Z80 source) code would be GREATYLY
appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Ian Justman
6612 Whitsett Drive
North Highlands, CA  95660

{ames, att, sun, apple, pyramid}!pacbell!sactoh0!ijpc!ianj (My PC)
same as above, but replace "ijpc" with "ijsys" to reach my CP/M box.

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 90 02:03:24 GMT
From: spdcc!mirror!pallio![e-mail]  (David Goodenough)
Subject: Kaypro 10 and Even Parity
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]> Thomas C. Allard says:
> Can anyone tell me how to set even parity on a Kaypro with a Incomm 2400
> baud modem.  I'm running Mex+ .....

Try QTERM. The Kaypro patch has been checked extensively, and does the
right thing when it comes to messing with the baud rate and comm mode.

If you want a copy, it's available on the server here: put the following
lines in mail sent to pallio!rna ([e-mail])

/send help to your_address
/send index to your_address

that will get sone info on the server, and this line

/send qterm to your_address

will send a copy of qterm. Note that in all cases, 'your_address' should be
replaced by either a bang path from a backbone site, or an Internet style
address ([e-mail]). If you need the kaypro patch, I can send that
out, but the general collection of patches isn't available yet since I'm
still upgrading some from the V4.1e days.
--
    [e-mail] - David Goodenough        +---+
                        IHS    | +-+-+
    ..... !harvard!xait!pallio!dg            +-+-+ |
AKA:    [e-mail]              +---+

------------------------------

Date: 17 Aug 90 16:30:22 GMT
From: usc!samsung!munnari.oz.au!sirius.ucs.adelaide.edu.au!levels![e-mail]
Subject: Kaypro 4 and 2400 Baud
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] writes:
> Thanks for the info.   I am still running at 2.5MHz, does anyone know
> If I can get a clock speed upgrade to 5 or 8 MHz? and If so, from where
> and how much It will cost me?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Monty: You're SURE you finished?   | BITNET:NETOPRDW AT NCSUVM
> Gadget: Sure I'm sure.             | internet:[e-mail]
> Monty: Not like the Last time?     |_____________________________________
> Gadget: Oh, Monty, How many times can the wings fall off a plane?

You may find all the info you need in a few old issues of MicroCornucopia.
Give them a ring at 503-382-5060 Someone may answer still (if you're lucky)
and then you can order the right issues.  Alternatively, you could send
something to POB 223; Bend, Oregon  97709.  I know uC is out of business, but
you may still get in touch (Dave Thompson is a great guy)  Also, you could
contact Microsphere in Bend too.  Dave's bro runs it & is still in business.
503-388-1194   (Beware, these numbers are from a 1985 issue so don't get mad
if they aren't correct)

Of course if all this fails, send me your address and I'll send you some copies
of the pertinent articles.  They had Ram disks and video mods too so check
it out!  See you.

Ronn

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #131
*************************************
22-Aug-90 07:26:14-MDT,19980;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 22 Aug 90 07:15:06 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #132
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Wed, 22 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  132

Today's Topics:
          22DISK:  MS/DOS <=> CP/M File transfers. (2 msgs)
                    86-88 MicroSys Journals Cheap
                   How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
                           QIC 36 interface
                               UZI-280?
                        Z80 multitask (2 msgs)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 20 Aug 90 08:55:49 PDT (Monday)
From: [e-mail]
Subject: 22DISK:  MS/DOS <=> CP/M File transfers.
Message-ID: <900820-100100-1669@Xerox>

Does anyone use the 22DISK shareware program on a PC, to transfer files to
and from Xerox 820 series disks?  At this point, I only have the shareware
verison, not the registered version.  I thought I would make sure it would
work for me, before I actually paid the registration fee.  I can *NOT* get
it to work however.

The shareware version supports 5 different Xerox formats, though one has
nothing to do with the 820's (perhaps it's for the Xerox 6085 workstation).
I started out trying the standard Xerox 820-II format.  It could find no
files on the 820 disk I was using, even though my 820-II said there were.
I tried formatting an 820-II disk on the PC, but the 820 could not read it.
I assume this is because my PC could not write track 0 as single density.

The other day, I recieved some disks through the mail, contaning some
public domain software that I had been looking for.  It had been formatted
for the 820-II 16/8 DEM.  22DISK could not read these disks either, even
though two different DEM formats (called EM-II in Uniform and 22 DISK),
including the proper one are supported.

The only Xerox 820 series format I have not tried is the single density 820
format.  In addition, when I looked at the Disk Definition file for 22DISK,
I think the section for the single density 820 is wrong.

What I would like to know before I waste any more time on 22DISK, is if
anyone else has used it with any success on one of the Xerox 820 series
computers.

                ~ Mike

------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 02:46:57 GMT
From: hub.ucsb.edu![e-mail]
Subject: 22DISK:  MS/DOS <=> CP/M File transfers.
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

-Message-Text-Follows-
In article <900820-100100-1669@Xerox>, [e-mail] writes...
>
>Does anyone use the 22DISK shareware program on a PC, to transfer files to
>and from Xerox 820 series disks?  At this point, I only have the shareware
>verison, not the registered version.  I thought I would make sure it would
>work for me, before I actually paid the registration fee.  I can *NOT* get
>it to work however.


If all else fails, contact the folks who publish 22DISK at Sybex. I have
found them to be EXTREEMLY helpfull. I had problems with formatting
Morrow disks (read and wrote fine). Upon contacting them, they sent
me a disk mailer to send to them a disk formatted on my Morrow. They then
sent me back a 'tweeked' configuration file that worked fine.


                      +-----------------------------------+
                      |         Charles R. Meyer          |
                      |                                   |
                      | Internet: [e-mail] |
                      | Bitnet:   crmeyer@voodoo          |
                      | HEPnet:   voodoo::crmeyer         |
                      +-----------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: 20 Aug 90 10:32:26 GMT
From: sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!lavaca.uh.edu!uhnix1!lobster!urchin![e-mail]  (Charles Cotham)
Subject: 86-88 MicroSys Journals Cheap
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I would love to have the magazines. If they are still available could
you send them  to the address below. Include a note as to how much the
shipping is and I will get it right back to you or leave me a note here
and I will be glad to get the money off to you as soon as I get your
address. Thanks much for your time.

          Charles Cotham
          2205 Lilac St.
          Nederland, Tex 77627
          Ph. # 409-727-6156

------------------------------

Date: 20 Aug 90 17:35:11 GMT
From: hpfcso!hpldola!hp-lsd![e-mail]  (Bill Stubblebine)
Subject: How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Several weeks ago, I asked for advice on how to improve throughput for bulk
data transfers from my SCSI hard disk to my SCSI QIC tape drive.  For those
who missed the original article, my configuration is:

    Ampro LB Z80+ (w/built-in SCSI interface)
    Adaptec ACB4000 (not 4000A) SCSI hard disk controller
    Seagate ST-125 20 MB 40 ms hard disk drive
    3M MCD-403 40 MB QIC SCSI tape drive
    NZ-COM/Z-System

The 3M MCD-403 SCSI tape drive was added recently to support backups.  As I
started transferring data between the hard disk and the tape drive, I
discovered that although the SCSI disk performance was adequate for
interactive and disk-to-disk operations, the hard disk could not source or
sink data fast enough to keep the tape drive streaming during transfers.

Before I posted my original request, I had experimented with several disk
transfer strategies to try to increase throughput.  All of my tests
employed standard BIOS calls that transfers 128 bytes per BIOS call, based
on Ampro's BIOS deblocking algorithm that reads or writes 512-byte SCSI
logical blocks to the hard disk.  My experiments indicated that BIOS calls
could never achieve sufficient throughput to keep the cartridge tape drive
streaming, no matter what the interleave factor is on the tape drive or on
the disk drive.  With all the stopping, repositioning and restarting of the
cartridge drive, the overall throughput from disk to tape was under 3K
bytes per second, plus the agony of hearing the drive stop and start for
each 8K SCSI tape block transferred.

Having run out of ideas, I asked the net for advice, and was gratified by
the quantity and quality of the responses I received.  To make a long story
short, I have increased the overall throughput of disk to tape transfers
from under 3K bytes per second to 12.7K bytes per second, allowing 10
megabytes to be backed up in about 13 minutes unattended.  This is bliss
compared to the endless attended floppy disk backups I am accustomed to.

To assist anyone who may be facing similar system integration problems, I
decided to keep a log of my experiments, which is summarized below.  The
quadrupling of throughput from 3K bytes/sec to 12.7K bytes/sec resulted
from three categories of improvements to my configuration:

1. Read or write as many bytes as possible in each SCSI command, both from
   the SCSI hard disk and the SCSI tape drive.

2. Use the Z80 high-speed INIR/OTIR I/O instructions instead of software
   controlled byte-by-byte handshaking to talk to the 5380 SCSI interface
   chip on the Ampro LB+.

3. Once #1 and #2 are implemented, select optimal interleave factors on
   both the hard disk and the tape drive to maximize overall throughput.


The biggest improvement came from #1.  Reading 8k from the disk in one SCSI
command more than doubled the overall throughput compared to normal BIOS
calls, providing streaming operation in the tape drive for tape interleave
factors of 6:1 or greater.

        HD interleave:        9:1
        HD transfer mode:    byte-by-byte
        HD transfer size:    8K x 1
        Tape interleave:    6:1
        Tape transfer mode:    byte-by-byte
        Tape transfer size:    8K x 1
        Net throughput:        6631 Kbytes/sec

Next, I modified the disk read routine to read 8K bytes in two 4K SCSI
commands, thereby simulating processing two distinct 4K CP/M disk
allocation groups.  The results were the same as for a single 8K SCSI
operation, i.e., the tape keeps streaming.  This experimental result
suggests that the disk-to-tape backup program should bypass the BIOS
altogether, and process CP/M allocation groups directly from the CP/M disk
directory entries, converting the (4K-byte) CP/M allocation group number
into a SCSI logical block number, then read all 4K of the allocation block
from the disk in one SCSI command.  This should be a robust strategy,
because (in the Ampro system) HD space cannot be allocated in chunks of
less than 4K bytes = 1 CP/M allocation group.

        HD interleave:        9:1
        HD transfer mode:    byte-by-byte
        HD transfer size:    4K x 2
        Tape interleave:    6:1
        Tape transfer mode:    byte-by-byte
        Tape transfer size:    8K x 1
        Net throughput:        6631 Kbytes/sec

Next, I changed the SCSI handshakng from byte-by-byte to INIR/OTIR burst
mode for both the hard disk and the MCD tape drive.  This increased the
burst transfer rate from 15us per byte to 5.25us per byte for both devices.

Using a scope to monitor the SCSI bus, I then experimented with bulk SCSI
transfers from hard disk at various disk interleave factors, obtaining the
following surprising results:

        Hard Disk    Time to transfer
        Interleave    8192 bytes HD->memory
        ----------    ----------------
           2:1            165ms
           3:1             80ms
           4:1             95ms
           5:1            110ms
           6:1            120ms
           7:1            140ms
           8:1            120ms
           9:1            140ms

At an interleave of 3:1, the fastest for bulk SCSI transfers, the hard disk
supports a burst transfer rate of 5.25us per byte = 190.4K bytes/sec to the
Ampro host, and a sustained data transfer rate of 102.4K bytes/sec, not bad
for a lowly Z-80.

Note: The previous and new interleave factors of 2:1 and 3:1, respectively,
      have virtually identical throughput for 512-byte BIOS transfers to
      and from disk.  However, for multi-block transfers like the ones I
      intend to use for tape backups, an interleave of 3:1 produces a huge
      (i.e., >double) increase in disk throughput compared to an interleave
      factor of 2:1.

With the hard disk formatted with interleave factor 3:1 and with burst mode
data transfers in effect to both the hard disk and the tape drive, I then
experimented with various tape drive interleave factors.  The result is
that I now can keep the tape drive streaming at a tape interleave factor of
4:1, which is much better than I had originally hoped.  The overall disk to
tape throughput increased to 9716 bytes/sec in this configuration.

        HD interleave:        3:1
        HD transfer mode:    burst
        HD transfer size:    4K x 2
        Tape interleave:    4:1
        Tape transfer mode:    burst
        Tape transfer size:    8K x 1
        Net throughput:        9716

Reading data from the hard disk in two 4K byte chunks takes about 80ms.  A
scope trace of SCSI bus activity indicated that a disk rotation was being
lost between reading sequential 4K chunks, even when the two chunks were
(logically) adjacent to one another on the same disk track, as is usually
the case in large sequential files.  When I repeated the experiments
reading 8K from the disk in one SCSI request, the time required to fill the
memory buffer from the disk dropped to around 60ms.  In this configuration,
the tape remained streaming at a tape interleave of 3:1, with overall
throughput from the disk to the tape increasing to 12787 bytes/sec.

        HD interleave:        3:1
        HD transfer mode:    burst
        HD transfer size:    8K x 1
        Tape interleave:    3:1
        Tape transfer mode:    burst
        Tape transfer size:    8K x 1
        Net throughput:        12787 Kbytes/sec

Getting writes to work to the tape was quite an adventure.  The same trick
that worked effectively for reads from the tape, namely setting the burst
mode for 256-byte transfers, caused writes to the tape to hang in mid SCSI
phase.  The curious thing was that the multi-block writes worked fine when
I stepped through them under manual control in the ZSID debugger, but hung
when running normally.  Figuring there was some race condition between the
disk reads and the tape writes, I fiddled around with delays everywhere to
no avail.  Because the multi-block transfers worked OK with byte-by-byte
handshaking, I finally concluded that 256 must be the wrong number of data
bytes to transfer to the tape controller in a burst during the SCSI
data-out phase.  But what was the right number?  I set the burst mode to 16
bytes per burst, which cut the byte-by-byte overhead by a factor of 16.
This worked fine, allowing writes to the tape to stream at a tape
interleave factor of 3:1, the same as for reads.

Note:  I still cannot explain why write transfers to the tape drive hang
       with 256 byte bursts and not with 16 byte bursts.  Reads and writes
       both transfer 8192 bytes from or to the tape controller.  This
       should loop the OTIR instruction exactly 32 times for 256 byte
       bursts and exactly 512 times for 16-byte bursts.  Moreover, the
       transfer rate in either case is only one third of the tape drive
       controller's 500Kb/sec rated SCSI burst throughput.  Maybe the
       discrepancy in the number of bytes transfered is on a 16-byte
       boundary, but I find this hard to believe.  My 16-byte burst
       solution works, but maybe I'll just RTFM one more time...)

None of my experiments thus far involved frequent head seeks on the hard
disk, which are bound to add some overhead to the tape transfers, and could
cause loss of streaming.  To allow some overhead for head seeks, and still
keep the tape streaming, I relaxed the tape interleave factor from 3:1 to
4:1.

All in all, I'm quite happy with the results.  I know that I can do 12.7K
bytes/sec at 3:1 tape interleave, and nearly 10K bytes/sec at 4:1 tape
interleave.  Depending on the tape interleave I finally settle on, I have
either tripled or quadrupled the overall disk-to-tape throughput compared
to where I started, and learned a little about my disk drive, my tape drive
and the SCSI protocol in the process.

Now it's on to building a primitive file system to manage my backups on the
cartridge tape.  Since I envision the tape as just an archive of large
backups (.LBR or tar files), without alot of random access going on, I'm
inclined toward using a simple directory structure similar to the one for
Novosielski .LBR files, but based on SCSI addressing instead of CP/M tracks
and sectors.  I'm flexible though, and I'd welcome any suggestions anyone
might have regarding a file system for the cartridge tape.

Lastly, a small personal note:  Over the years I've had to put up with no
end of criticism from associates regarding my ongoing interest in Z80
computers.  Still, I'm continually amazed at my ability to continually push
the envelope of this friendly little OS and CPU.

One of my other hobbies is sailing.  I get endless pleasure from trimming
the sails, reading the wind, pushing the last 1% out of the system.  I get
the same feeling when talking to one of those so-called DOS "power users"
as I do when some muscle boat goes tearing past me on the water.  I remark
to myself "very impressive - but what do you do after the first 10 minutes
when the novelty's worn off?"

Thanks again for all the help.  It's nice to know there is still a group
that shares some of my opinions.  Perhaps I can return the favor one day.

                                Bill Stubblebine
                                Hewlett-Packard Logic Systems Div.
                                Colorado Springs, CO
                                [e-mail]  (Internet)
                                [phone]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 20 Aug 90 19:55:37 PDT
From: [e-mail] (Will Rose)
Subject: QIC 36 interface
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Does anyone know any *manufacturer's* id numbers for tape drives that
implement the  QIC 36 interface?  Did this standard ever catch on?  I've
got a card that will convert SCSI=>QIC 36, and my CP/M machine can handle
SCSI, so if I can only find a tape drive to put on the end of it all I
have a backup system...

(It's no use my asking the makers of tape drives -they'd try to sell me
a new one, spoil the whole fun of the thing!)

All suggestions gratefully received - Will

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"You think that your career    | Will Rose
 will suffer if Dr. Kenworthy  |
 learns you have the poisoned  | UUCP:{nosc ucsd hplabs!hp-sdd}!crash!pnet01!c
 corpse of our fiancee in the  | ARPA:crash!pnet01![e-mail]
 ice box?"                     | INET:[e-mail]
 Evelyn Waugh, "The Loved One" |

UUCP: {nosc ucsd hplabs!hp-sdd}!crash!pnet01!cwr
ARPA: crash!pnet01![e-mail]
INET: [e-mail]


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 22 Aug 90 13:09+0200
From: [e-mail]
Subject: UZI-280?
Message-ID: <900822110949.719125@DMZRZU71-UNI-MAINZ--GERMANY>

There are rumours that the programmer of UZI, Doug Brown, will release
a version of UZI for Z280. Is this true? I'd love to hear so.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ruediger Soerensen, University of Mainz, W. Germany
                    Dpt. of Meteorology

BITNET:         ROGER@DMZRZU71
                  CPM@DMZRZU71
paper mail:
                    R. Soerensen
                    Universitaet Mainz
                    Inst. f. Meteorologie
                    D-6500 Mainz 1
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 09:42:35 GMT
From: mcsun!hp4nl!ruuinf!praxis![e-mail]  (Louis van Dompselaar)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...

Louis
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 09:20:03 GMT
From: eru!luth!sunic!mcsun!hp4nl!charon![e-mail]  (Jurjen NE Bos)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (Louis van Dompselaar) writes:

>Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
>on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...

>Louis
>[e-mail]

Easy!  We (4 friends and me) built a multi-user Z80 systems already years
ago, featuring 512K RAM, two real floppy drives while the users thought
they had 4 floppies each (but if you wanted to read something, you had to
walk over and insert your floppy), 5 terminals, etc.
The system is still running, and today they are working on a LAN, hard disk,
and more goodies.

The trick is to get some coprocessors for things like key scanning, disk I/O,
and other work that tends to eat away cycles.  The CPU can then start doing
only the more useful things.  But of course, we had a lot more performance-
increasing tricks...
--
|                 | "Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what |
| Jurjen N.E. Bos | it might appear to others that what you were or might |
|                 | have been was not otherwise than what you had been    |
|  [e-mail]  | would have appeared to them to be otherwise."         |

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #132
*************************************
24-Aug-90 00:41:50-MDT,9838;000000000000
Mail-From: KPETERSEN created at 24-Aug-90 00:26:44
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Fri, 24 Aug 90 00:26:43 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #133
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Fri, 24 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  133

Today's Topics:
                          SUBMIT replacement
                               UZI-280?
                        Z80 multitask (2 msgs)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 14:43:00 GMT
From: astroatc!nicmad!madnix!deety![e-mail]  (David Douthitt)
Subject: SUBMIT replacement
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

I've been having some trouble with SUBMIT.COM ...

I'm running on a hard disk, and have my application on drive C0:, my data
files used by my application(s) on drive D1:, and of course the $$$.SUB
on drive A0:.  I run my applications while logged into D1: - since I'm
running ZCPR 3.0, I set the path to C0: --> A15: --> A0:.

The problem is the $$$.SUB file is being created but not run until I do
a warmstart while logged into A0:

Is there a direct SUBMIT.COM replacement that will do the job?  I'm running
an Apple II+ with the PCPI Applicard.  What about EX?

    [david]


--
====== David Douthitt ======== aka "The Stainless Steel Rat" ====
UUCP: uwvax!astroatc!nicmad!madnix!deety!rat
InterNet: [e-mail]
<<<   Home of Mad Apple Forth and the Tiger Toolbox -- Apple II Forever!
<<<   If my next computer isn't an Apple II, it won't be a Macintosh.

------------------------------

Date: 23 Aug 90 22:00:38 GMT
From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!bu.edu!orc!inews!cadev4![e-mail]  (Doug Braun ~)
Subject: UZI-280?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Here is what's going on with UZI-280:

First, work is very sporadic.  I did a lot before April, and then didn't get
back to it until a few weeks ago.

Here is what works right now:

User/system address spaces:  64k user process plus 64k available
for kernel.  Kernel accesses user address space to get system call
arguments, etc.  Processes CANNOT corrupt kernel.

Traps are fully supported by kernel.  User processes can generate
segmentation violation, illegal I/O instruction, divide by zero, etc.
signals.  The brk and sbrk system calls set up the MMU to trap
wild pointers in user executables.  All of this is very much
like PDP-11 unix.

The kernel will trap itself (and panic) on kernel stack overflow,
null pointer, etc.  The kernel does not use the user's stack
(obviously).  There is a correct and robust mechanism for processes
to catch and ignore signals.

The TTY driver supports stty things such as echo, cbreak, and raw mode.

Virtual memory and paging are basis for memory managment and multiprogramming.
Forked processes share copy-on-write pages.  The old UZI swapping to disk
is no longer done.  The command response is now much faster.


What I'm working on right now:

The page replacement algorithm is very crude.
Page access timestamps need to be implemented for the page replacement
algorithm.

What I would eventually like to do:

Have proper interrupt-driven disk I/O.
Support split I and D space for processes, allow 64K code plus 64K data.
This would require supporting mixed 4K and 8K page sizes.
Have the system self-supporting, which means having compiler and linker
running under UZI  (This is currently feasible).


What's going on with utulities, compiler, etc.:

I have modified the Q/C Z80 C compiler to generate Z280 opcodes,
changing the code generator quite a bit to do better optimization.
This is really an entirely seperate product, that can also be
used on CP/M or as a cross-compiler.
Indexed addressing is used to access all automatics, and register
BC is for a register variable now.  Alas, the Q/C compiler copyright
prevents me from distributing this.  Clever ideas to overcome this
are welcome.

I have ported the "Stevie" vi clone (now named "v8") to UZI-280.  Alas,
it barely fits in 64K, so it cannot edit anything more than 25 lines long.
The split I/D enhancement would cure this.  (This is how vi runs on PDP-11s).
If anyone can recommend a screen-based editor I can get source to and port,
such as VDE or VDO, that would be fantastic.


Also,  I run CP/M 3 on my system now, so if anyone wants a Z280 BIOS for CP/M 3
with memory management (all the fancy stuff), let me know.

Doug Braun                Intel Corp CAD
                    408 765-4279

 / decwrl \
 | hplabs |
-| oliveb |- !intelca!mipos3!cadev4!dbraun
 | amd    |
 \ qantel /

 or:

 [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 12:44:07 GMT
From: mcsun!hp4nl!sci.kun.nl!cs.kun.nl![e-mail]  (Luc Rooijakkers)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

[e-mail] (Jurjen NE Bos) writes:

>[e-mail] (Louis van Dompselaar) writes:

>>Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
>>on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...

>Easy!  We (4 friends and me) built a multi-user Z80 systems already years
>ago, featuring 512K RAM, two real floppy drives while the users thought
>they had 4 floppies each (but if you wanted to read something, you had to
>walk over and insert your floppy), 5 terminals, etc.
>The system is still running, and today they are working on a LAN, hard disk,
>and more goodies.

>The trick is to get some coprocessors for things like key scanning, disk I/O,
>and other work that tends to eat away cycles.  The CPU can then start doing
>only the more useful things.  But of course, we had a lot more performance-
>increasing tricks...

But not too many. Since I'm the creator of the Timesharing software for
that machine (Hi Jurjen!), I will give some hints. By the way, the
software is still in use and amounts to about 12,000 lines assembly language
(when I last counted it about a year ago).

Basically, it all boils down to avoiding busy-waiting like the plague.
So ALL I/O devices have to be interrupt-driven, and in our environment
CP/M programs that constantly sit in a console-status loop are frowned
on. Unfortunately, there are quite a lot of these (WordStar, among
others, though we don't use it very much).

We run multiple CP/M 2.2 systems on the system, with a *big* BIOS that
does the sharing and lots of other work. The users each have 4 drives
which they can assign to any named disk. When needed, the system asks
for the disks, which can then be plugged in in any disk drive. We also
support the use of two 5M ST506 hard disks (very old PC hard disks) which
are attached to another Z80 system with a SASI adapter. The two systems
communicate over our own home-built 500Kbit/s token bus network (built
with Z80 SIO chips). The system uses about 100K for disk caching, since
we have plenty of memory.

It might be worth saying that we started this project back in 1984. The
system still works very satisfactory and is in daily use.

As a matter of fact, our system averages about 80 percent *idle* time.
Humans are just too slow to keep any computer busy. Of course, when you
start running more than one CPU-intensive application (like an
assembler, or a compiler) then they each get their share of the
available CPU time, proportional to the number of running programs. But
other I/O-intensive programs like text editors do not suffer from this
very much.

We did add a little bank switching logic external to the Z80, but that
was not really difficult. It basically consists of a 16 byte memory
that translates address lines A12 to A15 from the Z80 to address lines
A12 to A18 on the bus (the 8th bit is used for write protect). For
hardware freaks, these were just two 7485 chips and a few buffers.

One thing not possible with our setup is a *secure* multi-user environment,
but we didn't need that. You can do this using the more modern Z280 chip,
which has the MMU built on-chip (with 3 DMA-controllers and 256 bytes of
cache memory and lots of other goodies). The instruction set is upward
compatible with the Z80, and has nice additions like divide and multiply
instructions and lots of new adressing modes (e.g. LD HL,(SP+n) ). In fact,
we have a Z280 lying in some dusty corner, but just never found the time
to change our system for it. If you start building a new system, by all
means use a Z280! (To me, it has always seemed a waste to use the Z280
only for a CP/M Plus system, which several people seem to be doing
currently. It can do so much more!)

Summarizing, I would say that almost *anything* is possible. It only
depends on how much effort you want to spend on it. There are no
inherent limits in the Z80 processor that would limit you.

--
Luc Rooijakkers                                 Internet: [e-mail]
Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science     UUCP: uunet!cs.kun.nl!lwj
University of Nijmegen, the Netherlands         tel. [phone]

------------------------------

Date: 22 Aug 90 14:55:36 GMT
From: ns-mx!iowasp.physics.uiowa.edu![e-mail]
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Louis van Dompselaar) writes:
> Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
> on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...

   MP/M anyone ???

Bill

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #133
*************************************
25-Aug-90 07:31:21-MDT,10030;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 25 Aug 90 07:15:10 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #134
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Sat, 25 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  134

Today's Topics:
                *** Official release of UUCP V2.1b ***
                            SUBMIT Problem
                        Z80 multitask (3 msgs)
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 25 Aug 90 05:00:00 GMT
From: usc!snorkelwacker!spdcc!ima!mirror!pallio![e-mail]  (David Goodenough)
Subject: *** Official release of UUCP V2.1b ***
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Those that have been paying attention (or who use the uucp maps for light
bedtime reading :-) ) will be aware that pallio.UUCP is in fact a CP/M
system. The software that provides mail and news access has been in beta
test for several months, and V2.1b has now been officially released.

I will be posting it to GEnie, I'll try to get a copy to Keith Petersen's
Royal Oak BBS, and it can also be retrieved from the rna server here at
pallio. The last three lines of this posting (below the .sig file) when
sent to pallio!rna will get you what you need. Just change 'your-address'
to either a bang path from a backbone site, or to an Internet style FQDN
([e-mail] type thing). And to keep bandwidth down, put all three
in one letter, the server can cope with multiple requests in one message.
--
    [e-mail] - David Goodenough        +---+
                        IHS    | +-+-+
    ..... !harvard!xait!pallio!dg            +-+-+ |
AKA:    [e-mail]              +---+

/send help to your-address
/send index to your-address
/send uucp to your-address

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Aug 90 16:00:05 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: SUBMIT Problem

   David Douthitt wrote:

>> I've been having some trouble with SUBMIT.COM ...

   He then described the problem that arises when the $$$.SUB file in A0:
disappears from the command processor's sight when it is logged into a user
area other than 0.

   There is a very simple solution.  Get rid of that obsolete ZCPR30!
Version 3.3 fixed that problem by having the CCP look always in A0: for the
$$$.SUB file.

   This does occasionally cause some problems, however.  Some programs
(e.g., dBase) spawn tasks by writing out a $$$.SUB file and then
terminating.  Naturally, as conventional CP/M programs, they write the file
to the current user area.  Z33 and Z34 will not see the file at all.  I
beleive that patches have been published for some of the programs to make
them write to A0:.  The ZSDOS DOS path searching facility can also solve
this problem (and probably ZCPR30's problem, as well).

-- Jay Sage


------------------------------

Date: 23 Aug 90 17:25:03 GMT
From: cs.utexas.edu!samsung!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!emory!hubcap!ncrcae!ncr-sd!simasd!simasd!pnet07![e-mail]  (Don Maslin)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Or if you really want to reach for it - OASIS

UUCP: {nosc ucsd crash ncr-sd}!pnet07!donm
ARPA: simasd!pnet07![e-mail]
INET: [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 23 Aug 90 20:02:06 GMT
From: swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!hellgate.utah.edu!cc.utah.edu!cc.usu.edu![e-mail]  (Roger Ivie)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Louis van Dompselaar) writes:

> Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
> on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...

I've done two multi-tasking things on a Z80. The first is that I experimented
with MP/M on an Apple Softcard; I wrote a simple MP/M BIOS that simply called
the CP/M BIOS. I had two jobs going: one just barely large enough to load
Microsoft BASIC and the other just barely large enough to run PIP when
BASIC was loaded in the other. It was lots of fun.

You might still be able to get MP/M. I bought a brand new copy about a year
ago, but still have yet to do anything with it. I intend to eventually get
it running on my NorthStar; I seem to keep collecting bankswitched memory
cards for the thing.

The other thing I've done with multitasking was for an embedded system. The
company I work for makes an IEEE-488 interface to the VAXBI whereon the
IEEE-488 is entirely managed by a Z80 (i.e.: the VAX politely requests that
the Z80 do the work for it. Not fast, but it did make the BI interface
very simple. Oh yeah; the Z80 knows how to translate VAX virtual addresses;
that was fun). The whole thing is written in assembler and uses a decendant
of an 8080 multi-tasking kernel originally published in BYTE back when BYTE
published that sort of thing.
--
===============================================================================
Roger Ivie

35 S 300 W
Logan, Ut.  84321
[phone]
===============================================================================

------------------------------

Date: 25 Aug 90 00:35:26 GMT
From: mcsun!hp4nl!phigate!philica![e-mail]  (Geert Jan de Groot)
Subject: Z80 multitask
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Luc Rooijakkers) writes:
>[e-mail] (Jurjen NE Bos) writes:
>
>>[e-mail] (Louis van Dompselaar) writes:
>
>>>Is there anyone who has had some experience in using multitasking
>>>on a Z80 system? Please let me know what is, and what is not, possible...
>
>>Easy!  We (4 friends and me) built a multi-user Z80 systems already years
>>ago, featuring 512K RAM, two real floppy drives while the users thought
>>they had 4 floppies each (but if you wanted to read something, you had to
>>walk over and insert your floppy), 5 terminals, etc.
>>The system is still running, and today they are working on a LAN, hard disk,
>We did add a little bank switching logic external to the Z80, but that
>was not really difficult. It basically consists of a 16 byte memory
>that translates address lines A12 to A15 from the Z80 to address lines
>A12 to A18 on the bus (the 8th bit is used for write protect). For
>hardware freaks, these were just two 7485 chips and a few buffers.

A small correction (I am the 'hardware' member of this group, hi Jurjen,
Luc): I have had some requests earlier about how to do this, but
(yes, I'm ashamed!) lost the Email address:
We used 7489's instead of 7485's. 7489's are small, 16x4 bit wide RAMS, but
very fast (1984 standards, youth scientist's budget, i.e. remove from
scrap PCBs from a large electronics firm in Eindhoven).
A15-A12 of the Z80 are connected to the address lines of these RAMs, giving
4Kbyte pages. The  data-out lines of these RAMS (we have 2 of them, so 8
bit) are the address lines that go to the rest of the system.
One line is reserved for write-protection, giving a 512 Kbyte addres space.
In this address space, there is some memory-mapped I/O (a number of
video displays), but there is plenty of room left for users.

How does one control the RAMs for address remapping? This doesn't seem easy,
but it worked out for us: fortunately, thos RAM devices have separate data-in
lines. Those data-in lines are connected to the databus.
If one uses the 'OUT (B),A' instruction, the CPU really executes
'OUT (BC),A', thus the contents of register C are on A8-15 of the CPU,
and you can put the address of the RAM location on b4-7 of register C.
Register B contains the I/O address of the RAM chip as usual, and A
contains the new contents.
Nice and simple. We even didn't need to use an undocumented feature of the
Z80; all of this is documented and guaranteed.

A Nice Thing about running a multi-user system like this is that there is
always a layer 'above' your own program. If your program crashes, under
the condition it didn't scribble in the I/O devices (a big no-no for
multiuser of course), a special key combination is enough to 'reboot'
your virtual CP/M machine; no need to re-load the operating system.

The only problem is that all CP/M utilities don't know about the environment
they're in and don't know they can fork() and things like that. We wrote
all client-slave software ourselves, because IPC isn't defined in CP/M.
But, all of the CP/M software we know of works fine on one of the virual
machines of our multiuser system, and we don't have much non-standard
software (only for demonstration purposes).

Still a pleasure to work with! And because of the scrap material, it costed
only Hfl 1000,- (can't get disk drives from scratch). Physically, it is
a 19" rack more than 1.5 meter high, crammed with racks full of PCB's.
It takes at least 2 men to lift it. A real monster, but nice!

Why didn't we use MP/M? It was not available (as in: we didn't have a copy),
and the young scientists' budget didn't allow us to buy it.
We got CP/M via a machine which doesn't exist anymore (I think),
and our only chance was to re-use the software that came with that machine..
Remember, this was the time that Exidy Sourcerers were Hot Machines,
and we built the thing because the only Exidy we had was always busy.
It serves its purpose well.


Geert Jan


--8<--nip-nip---------------------------------------------------------------

Geert Jan de Groot,        Email: [e-mail]
Philips ICA,                   ..!hp4nl!philica!geertj
Weisshausstrasse,        Ham: PE1HZG
5100 Aachen, West-Germany

phone: [phone]         "Programs are like waffles:
fax:   [phone]         you should always throw the first one out"
[Standard disclaimers apply]     - Sutherland

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #134
*************************************
29-Aug-90 18:24:56-MDT,9967;000000000000
Return-Path: <[e-mail]>
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 90 18:15:17 MDT
From: [e-mail]
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-CPM Digest V90 #135
To: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

INFO-CPM Digest             Wed, 29 Aug 90       Volume 90 : Issue  135

Today's Topics:
                           CP/M internals?
                   How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
                       kaypro II kaput (2 msgs)
                        Kaypro II needs help!
                                submit
                               UZI-280?
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 29 Aug 90 22:27:38 GMT
From: eru!hagbard!sunic!sics.se!sics.se![e-mail]  (Kent Boortz)
Subject: CP/M internals?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Could someone explain to me how a typical CP/M (8085) system is working?
What parts are there, and where are they (ROM/RAM/disk)?
What functions do they have? How do they call each other?
How is the memory organised? Maybe you can explain the boot process?

What parts of the CP/M OS can I replace with freeware/shareware alternatives?

Why do I ask this? I am trying to write a hardware emulator for 8085 in MC68020
assembler (just for fun) and is curious if it is possible, with not to much
work, to port a CP/M system to it. The ideal case would be a OS that used
the OUT and IN instructions for all communication with the hardware, except
the screen that could be memory mapped.


Kent Boortz
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 10 Aug 90 07:21:54 GMT
From: snorkelwacker!usc!sdd.hp.com!mips!prls!philabs!linus!nixbur!nixpbe!peun11![e-mail]  (Moellers)
Subject: How to speed up Ampro LB+ SCSI?
Message-ID: <josef.650272914@peun11>

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Clarence Wilkerson) writes:

>Could you implement "scsi device to scsi device" transfer without having
>to go through
>the CPU? This is possible under some circumstances ( e.g. two disks on
>same controller ),
>but I'm not sure of the generality.

From what I know about SCSI, I'd say it depends. (This is standard
answer #75534)

SCSI distinguishes between initiator and target.
The initiator selects a target and then the target requests from the
initiator whatever information is needed (command block, data, message)
or sends to the initiator whatever information it holds (data, status,
message).
Usually, hosts are initiators and devices are targets.
So, in order to do a "device to device" transfer, You'll have to have
one device that can act as an initiator, communication with another
device that continues to behave as a target.
Some tape drives can do this. You just tell'em to read n blocks of data
from target x and then leave it to do it's task. If You were to look at
the SCSI bus, You'd see the tape drive selecting the disk, the drive
requesting command blocks from the tape, then sending data to the tape,
etc.
Probably one or the other controller can do a disk-to-disk-copy locally,
but that would be very controller specific.

--
| Josef Moellers        |    c/o Nixdorf Computer AG    |
|  USA: [e-mail]    |    Abt. PXD-S14        |
| !USA: [e-mail]    |    Heinz-Nixdorf-Ring    |
| Phone: [phone]    |    D-4790 Paderborn    |

------------------------------

Date: 28 Aug 90 22:25:07 GMT
From: janus.Berkeley.EDU![e-mail]  (Dan Senderowicz)
Subject: kaypro II kaput
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

My old kaypro II just died of old age. The cpu board works but
there is no video. The crt gun is cold, indicating probably that
the tube is bad (filament) or something is wrong with the power
supply (maybe the transformer).  I would really appreciate it if
anybody has the service manuals to lend thme to me so I can get
a better insight of the hardware. I called Kaypro but they don't
longer have anything for that machine.  Thanks.

Dan.

------------------------------

Date: 29 Aug 90 07:28:35 GMT
From: ogicse!milton!blake.acs.washington.edu![e-mail]  (Finn)
Subject: kaypro II kaput
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]> synchrods![e-mail] (Dan Senderowicz) writes:
>My old kaypro II just died of old age. The cpu board works but
>there is no video. The crt gun is cold, indicating probably that
>the tube is bad (filament) or something is wrong with the power
>supply (maybe the transformer).  I would really appreciate it if
>anybody has the service manuals to lend thme to me so I can get
>a better insight of the hardware. I called Kaypro but they don't
>longer have anything for that machine.  Thanks.


You are in luck!  The Kaypro machines are totally generic.. meaning they used
the standard stuff of the era (except for the keyboard) and much like disk
drives and PC power supplies are today, you can plug in almost anything and
have it work.

 Specificly, the Kaypro used the Ball monitor.  Not that they bought the
monitors from Ball, but bought whatever was cheapest that week.  You want
to look closely at the card edge plug on the monitor in your machine..
you'll see there are 10 contact points and a slot cut near one end.  Your
local computer parts supply and junque dealer may not still know what a
Ball monitor is, but if it has that same connector, it's going to work
99 times out of a hundred.  Now the only trick is finding one the right
size for your case.. although I have built Frankenkaypros fom junk parts
and used everything from ultra small cash machine style monitors to huge
16 inch monitors.  Last I bought one of these things ( a couple of years
ago) the going rate was $25 for a used or grungy but workable monitor,
about $40 for new surplus stuff and real nice ones maybe as high as $65.

 The above is an assumption that your monitor has packed it in.. the
power supply is a simple 5 and 12 volt switching supply and it is pretty
unlikely that it would keep the motherboard and drives happy and fail to
deliver the 12 volts to the monitor only.  Just to be safe, before
spending any money on the monitor, make sure you have +12 on pin 7 on
the monitor connector.  (The connector may not be numbered, but the
notch is between 9 and 10)  If you are interested the connector on the
monitor is as follows:
 1  Ground
 2
 3
 4  Brightness pot on 2 & 3 with wiper to 4
 5  Arc Gnd (often not used)
 6  Horz. Sync.
 7  + 12
 8  Video
 9  Vert. Sync.
 Notch
 10 Ground

 If your power supply is NOT making 5 and 12 volts, then it will also
run you $30 - $40 if you shop around.  You can use almost any reasonably
rated switching power supply that will fit into the case.  You may or
may not have to re-do the power supply connector.  Usually the outputs
on power supplies are well labled.  It is important to get the same
voltages into the same wires. Check everything twice, then have someone
else check it for you.  (I once toasted 2 drives at once by sending
12 volts down a wire that turned out to want 5 volts.)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Aug 90 10:13:01 PDT
From: [e-mail] (Roger Hanscom)
Subject: Kaypro II needs help!
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

Hello All --
Any Kaypro II users out there??  I've got one that acts like someone's
leaning on the three key.  When I power it on, the "A>" prompt comes up,
but then a line and a half of threes follows.  CP/M tries to interpret
that as a command line, echoes it back (followed by a "?"), and then the
whole thing starts again.  It does this with the keyboard disconnected
also.  Once I got CP/M to come up clean, but then the first key I pressed
filled the screen ("D" from "dir").  I've got no schematic, so I haven't
much of a clue where to start to look.  Anybody seen this before??  Does
the keyboard (serial) go in via a PIO, SIO, or a TTL 8-bit serial shift
register (74LS164 ??) ?  Any comments would be appreciated.

              roger           [e-mail]
                              [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 27 Aug 90 13:11:50 GMT
From: usc!samsung!munnari.oz.au!sirius.ucs.adelaide.edu.au!levels![e-mail]
Subject: submit
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David Douthitt) writes:
> I've been having some trouble with SUBMIT.COM ...
>

Yes you should try EX14.  If you want it I got it.  You could also try
SUB34.LBR in pd2:<cpm.zcpr33> on SIMTEL if you can in there.  It's for the
Z system of course.
Also, I have some stuff for the apple with the PCPI card, a ram disk soft
package and sysgen type stuff.  I believe it's Ozzie stuff so you may not
have it.  If you're interested, let me know.  I've got no use for it but upload
material.  What disk formats can you do?

Ronn

------------------------------

Date: 24 Aug 90 11:45:24 GMT
From: usc!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!lavaca.uh.edu!uhnix1!sugar!ficc![e-mail]  (Peter da Silva)
Subject: UZI-280?
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Doug Braun ~) writes:
> Here is what's going on with UZI-280:

[lots of good stuff]

So what's the difference between UZI and UNIX?

> If anyone can recommend a screen-based editor I can get source to and port,
> such as VDE or VDO, that would be fantastic.

There is another VI clone out there, "Elvis". Coming to alt.sources soon.
--
Peter da Silva.   `-_-'
[phone].   'U`
[e-mail]

------------------------------

End of INFO-CPM Digest V90 Issue #135
*************************************