Day 251 - 17 May 96 - Page 16

     
     1   Q.   I said to you the Morganti lists, did you send that list to
     2        the Pastoral Land Commission?
     3        A.  Yes.
     4
     5   Q.   Is this their response?
     6        A.  This is their response.
     7
     8   Q.   Are the municipalities mentioned on their list in
     9        Portuguese with the list of ranches that they know of where
    10        there have been conflicts, are they -- well, you can
    11        translate the introduction, but is my understanding right
    12        that they are the specific areas which McDonald's had
    13        identified through the Morganti list?
    14        A.  Yes, they took this list of, I think it is, 97, about
    15        97, municipios, which are the municipal, the local
    16        districts, in Goias where they were buying beef, buying
    17        cattle, and out of this list roughly a third, according to
    18        the Pastoral Land Commission, they figure in their list of
    19        municipios, of local districts, where there are ranches
    20        which have had either land conflicts or have had serious
         problems with the treatment of the labour force on these
    22        ranches.  They specify in their ----
    23
    24   Q.   May be if you could translate that?
    25        A.  What I have got is a very poor photocopy, but I think I
    26        can read it.  Here is the listing of areas with conflicts
    27        in the municipios, the local districts, that supply meat to
    28        McDonald's but Braslo it should be, should it not?  The
    29        list was made taking all the areas in these locations
    30        independently of the fact whether there is or not
    31        continuity in the conflict due to the lack of time, because
    32        I only faxed them...  They have not had very much time to
    33        actually investigate.  What they are actually saying in
    34        this paragraph is, these are the ranches where there have
    35        been land conflicts or reported abuses of the labour force,
    36        some of them may be overlayed, a settlement may have been
    37        reached, they may not all be land conflicts which are still
    38        continuing.  They say "we include both land conflicts..."
    39
    40   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  What I suggest you do, if you are going to
         pursue this, as you obviously are, you should get a written
    42        translation of it and then put your Civil Evidence Act
    43        notice on this statement of the -- it is a woman who has
    44        signed it?
    45        A.  Yes.
    46
    47   Q.   Inez?
    48        A.  Yes.
    49
    50   Q.   So that, subject to any argument from Mr. Rampton, becomes 
    51        her Civil Evidence Act statement, you understand?  What I 
    52        suggest you do, just so I can appreciate what it will be 
    53        said that this says in due course, it would be convenient
    54        to me if Miss Branford gives her translation.  Now, we will
    55        not necessarily treat that as part of her evidence, but so
    56        we can all see where we may be going at some stage in the
    57        future.  So would you like to start, 'to Sue Branford, BBC
    58        Americas' and then?
    59        A.  'Here is the survey of the areas in'.
    60